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Lakeland Currents you public affairs
program for north central Minnesota produced by
Lakeland PBS with host Ray Gildow.
Production funding for Lakeland Currents is made possible by Bemidji
Regional Airport serving the region with daily flights to the Minneapolis-
St. Paul International Airport. More information available at bemidjiairport.org.
Closed captioning for Lakeland
Currents is sponsored by Nisswa Tax Service. Tax
preparation for businesses and individuals online at
nisswatax.com. Ray Gildow: Hello again
everyone and welcome to Lakeland Currents where tonight we're doing something
we've done before in our 12 year history. We're
going to interview folks from Camp Ripley. And if you're at all
familiar with central Minnesota you know that somewhere between Little
Falls and Brainerd is a pretty good size
military training camp. If you're not a
military person with a military background you probably have never stepped foot on
this place. But it's a very, very interesting
well managed property. If you're a
deer hunter you may also have been there because there are people that go there
and go bow hunting. But I'd like to welcome my two guests
this evening who are from Camp Ripley. And first
to my right is Staff Sergeant
Tishel Schwegel [Yes]. I'm saying that right? And
[You are] you are the Senior Culinary Specialist
I Company 134th
Brigade Support Battalion. I'll get it out yet.
[laughing] And to her right is Chief
Warrant Officer Andrew Bachman, Chief Warrant Officer
3. [Correct] And it's important to have those numbers. And he's a Minnesota
National Guard Quarter Master. Andrew: That is correct, Sir. Ray: And
maybe we could start out with a little bit about your backgrounds.
Where you came from and how you got into
what you're doing now before we talk about the camp.
Tishel: I'm originally from Roseau, Minnesota.
I joined when I was a junior in high school, back in
2002. [Wow] So I have been in for 16 years.
Currently working with the
J4 office as the state food service
program manager. Ray: Great and
you've been how long at Camp Ripley? Tishel: I started
as a technician about a year and a half ago.
Ray: So when you....you think
you'll finish your career there? [Absolutely] Okay.
And how about you? Andrew: So I have been in
the National Guard since 1995. I enlisted
as a senior in high school. And
from there I've been with a unit in
Northfield down at Division Aviation
Brigade in the cities. And in 2007 I was
transferred up to Camp Ripley. And I've been up here
full time ever since as the State Quarter Master. Ray: Well lets talk a little bit about
the size of the camp and whose there. Whose
working there year round? Andrew: So year round
it fluctuates employee wise. But give or take year round there's about
800 employees full time. Only the
General and his family live full time as far as
on post. Everybody else comes and goes.
And the camp itself I believe is approximately
53,000 square acres. And predominately most of it is
training area. Ray: Is the camp growing at all?
Andrew: It is growing in the last few years
substantially. Even since I started there in 2007
a tremendous amount of building additions.
A lot of the old aluminum sheds that we've
had out there when we first started that we...
bivouacked in or whatever at annual training. A lot of those are gone
now replaced with more modern facilities. Ray: How about
land wise. Does the state still purchase property
for Camp Ripley or is that pretty much locked in?
Andrew: They do. They have a program called A-CUB
and I don't know exactly how it works but
they do occasionally purchase land
around Camp Ripley as a buffer. And I'm not
exactly sure how they do do that. But I know they still do that.
The environmental team works with that [inaudible] Ray: And you have
visitors that come from military groups
from not only America but from around the world.
Well at least from Norway. [Absolutely] And
how many do you have any idea how many soldiers
go through that camp in a typical year in the summertime?
Andrew: Well as far as National Guard I would say
it can fluctuate anywhere from
a few thousand to all the way up to I've heard numbers
somewhere around 10,000, 12,000,
10,000 person range for a training season. Ray: Wow, wow.
And in your role in the culinary fields
are you responsible to help feed all those people then?
Tishel: We do have a central dining
facility. And we do have a full time staff person
Staff Sergeant Christianson, she actually
kind of operates the National Guard side of that but then
they do also serve any other entities
that would be coming to Camp Ripley. So I know they do have
high numbers that they feed there as well. We would help them
with any type of MRA request.
Or if they have anything coming from
DLA which would be like the UGR Heat And Serves, we would
help with that aspect of it. Ray: So the
800 people that are working there, do they eat in... that mess hall then?
Or do they all have responsibilities they
figure that out on their own? Tishel: There are
some people who do go to the central dining facility
but I would say most of the time we eat
at the snack shop or they do bring
meals up to the tack which is where a lot of
the employees are for AGR staff.
And a lot of people probably bring their own.
Ray: Yeah. It's interesting. So one of the topics
that we want to talk about today is the Norway
Reciprocal Troop Exchange. And it's called
NOREX. Is that the correct
acronym for that? [Correct] And what is NOREX?
Andrew: So NOREX in a nutshell
started in 1974 between
Norwegian Major General Nygaard and
American at the time the National Guard Chief
Major General Greenlief. And it basically started
as a handshake as a cultural exchange.
So their soldiers would come here and train with us, American
soldiers. And the American soldiers would go to Norway
and train with Norwegian soldiers. And it
currently I believe is the longest allied exchange
of all the exchanges that the military does.
Ray: So they come typically like what July, August?
Or do they come in the winter time? Andrew: We've alternated.
Sometimes they come in the summer. Sometimes they come in the winter.
From what I've been told for future NOREX'S
were going to kind of continue with that winter theme.
Ray: And do you send troops
then to Norway... and reciprocate with
that? Andrew: We do. We send approximately 100 soldiers over
there too. Ray: And then is that like usually a two week assignment?
[Yes] Ray: Okay. And then what do they do when they're over there?
Andrew: So when they're over there they do
the military training. So we have all that
aspects, winter operations. And then they'll
also experience the cultural aspects in a way.
Ray: Have either of you been involved in that exchange? Andrew: I wish.
Ray: Not quite yet. Tishel: I'm actually gonna be part of it this year. Ray: So you'll get to
go to Norway. Tishel: Correct. Ray: And what month will you be going?
Tishel: We will be going in February. Ray: So, it's probably gonna
be winter there too, isn't it? Tishel: Yes. Ray: [laughs] It's not like you could've gone
to Florida or something. [No] Enjoy some warm weather.
And in your area then, what will you be doing when you go over there?
Tishel: I will be the...food service
person that goes along. I am in charge of the
American meal when we are over there. From my understanding
they do a Norwegian meal where they bring all of their
typical foods that they have. And then we will be
bringing I believe the....Trolling for Troops
is a big sponsor with Mancini
Steaks down in Minneapolis area. [Really?] And they donate
the steak meal for us to bring over there.
So we will be bringing steaks and potatoes
and I actually am
friends with the cook who went last year and she said they
look forward to the steaks the most
and apparently they are big for sweet tooth. So we're gonna bring
over a lot of desserts this year. Ray: It's a small world I
was with the person last summer who did that.
With the Mancini steaks. [Oh ok] One of the
people that work with that program and he was talking about that, that's pretty interesting.
Tishel: Yeah they give us the opportunity to go down there and learn how
to cook their steaks and....bring all of that knowledge
over to Norway. Ray: So do you do this...do you
bivouac at all? Are you out in the field during some of this? Or are
you on one of their military sites, in one of their mess halls?
Tishel: From my understanding we do go to basically like one of their
camp areas and they do take us...
down range or out in the field and
the stories that I have heard...I guess we
get to ski the mountain. So I guess I've never skied uphill
before. So that will be great training and something fun to
learn. Ray: Physically challenging, I'll bet yeah. Tishel: Yes, so
and I know that they do what's called like a buddy weekend.
Where the soldiers are allowed to go and learn
the different cultures over in Norway. I believe they do
that here as well. I know there have been a couple families who have
done that and they said it's a lot of fun. Ray: So do you fly over
in military planes when you're doing this? Tishel: I believe this
year we are flying commercial. Ray: Oh that'll be nice. [Yes] Better
than riding in some of those cargo planes. [Yes]
So it's a unique event. And you talked a
little bit how it got started with just a hand shake.
And is there....what else is interesting about
the history of this? What's happened over the years that you've been doing
this that might be of interest to people? Andrew: Well I think
you know initially I think it was more of a cultural exchange.
And throughout...and this is just some of the stories I've been told..this will be my
4th NOREX participating state side.
And what I've learned is it's become
they really kind of increased the mission or the op
tempo as we would call it. So like the training portion of
it is probably increased dramatically. Ray: So how many people
are typically involved? Are you gonna take a company
over? Andrew: So, there's approximately a hundred that go over
and a hundred that come over here. And then we have approximately
150 support staff here to support those
Norwegians. Ray: Interesting. Does everybody
in the camp take part of this in some way or another or no?
Andrew: Not everybody in camp. Camp Ripley operations
continues to function for other individuals that are using
the camp for different reasons. Cause there are different training facilities
there being used at all times of the year.
So we allocate those individuals well in advance
so they know they're going to be participating in the exchange
and those individuals will support it.
Ray: Does anybody speak Norwegian?
[laughter] Tishel: I'm Polish background so I......
I'm... Ray: That's not gonna help. Tishel: I did download the translator
though for Norway so, when I get over there if I have any
questions I have help. Ray: So I suppose that is part of your training is that
you do have to have interpreters along with you, do you?
To....or no? Andrew: The Norwegians speak very good English. Ray: They all speak English.
So that's not an issue at all? Andrew: It is not an issue. Ray: And
you said here it takes about 150 people to
support this operation. [Correct] And what are those people all doing?
What are some of the roles that you see there? Andrew: We have everything
from the individuals that are the operations
[inaudible] that run everything, the glue that holds it together.
To the logistic staff which includes
everything from our cooks to our bus drivers
to the individuals that are in charge of the warehouses
to issue out winter gear. We have individuals that
mirror the Norwegians Senior
officers to show them around. So, liaisons
Senior Training Coordinators, we call them. Company
Commanders, Executive Officers. And then...
just individuals that help on the ranges.
They have a very important role. Everybody from safety officers
safety non-commission officers. To the individuals
that are actually running the machines.
Ray: So we talk about American meals
and select meals, what are those terms meaning?
Tishel: I guess I'm not
really understanding the select meals part?
Ray: I wrote part of the question we've got here, we hear a lot about
select meal, what are they for, I guess is the question.
Andrew: Like the American meal...or the Norwegian
meal. Tishel: We basically just do it as kind of like our
gift to them for letting us come over. Ray: Is our food?
Tishel: Correct. And this year we are
gonna be bringing a couple of addition items
with. They said they would like to try bison.
So we are going to do a couple different varieties of
bison for them. And then we are also going to bring walleye
with us over there. Ray: How are you finding walleyes? I can't find
them? [laughs] Tishel: We actually can get that
distributed from Cisco, which is where we will be ordering all of
our food from. Ray: So they typically wouldn't be eating
these kinds of American foods. And what kinds of foods
do you expect to run across in Norway?
Tishel: I was told that they have a
very large meal over there with a lot
of the seafood because they are right near the ocean
so there's lobster, crab
they don't do a lot of the white fish
like we have here. They're more of the salmon type
of fish, so. Ray: And not as much red meat probably obviously as we have. [Correct]
Tishel: And that's why they look forward to that steak every year. Ray: I bet they do
yeah. Um.....
what are some of the...what are you finding as similarities
when you get together with Norwegians? What are some of the similarities
that you've experienced? Andrew: So one of the cultural
similarities that I've picked out from almost right from
the get go on my first NOREX was the
Minnesota nice aspect that we always discuss here. And
I always kinda wondered where that came from. And
and when I met the Norwegians within
a few hours I realized that we share
that. And I always kinda when I explain
it to my family, do the joke like when I say
would you like this? And then you say, well no that's ok.
And then I say, well please take it. And then we go back
and forth maybe two or three times before I finally take your "no"
for what it is. [laughter] And...
I picked up on that right away. It's the same shtick
so to say. Ray: Similarity. Andrew: Absolutely. Ray: We have a lot of
Norwegians in Minnesota. [Correct] A lot of Norwegians in
central Minnesota, too. I'm kind of curious
both of you joined the guards in high school.
[Mmhmm] What was it that triggered that for
you, I'm kinda curious about that. Because in my era
when I joined it was mostly after
high school or after college or back
in my era there was a draft, too, for people that got in the draft.
But what attracted you guys to get into the military?
Andrew: You go first. Tishel: The reason why I joined
is up in Roseau we do have a lot of flooding.
And the National Guard was one of the
main sources that came and helped with a lot of
that and I wanted to make sure that I was part of that because
I cared about my community a lot, so that was one of the reasons.
And then the other benefit of it was
there was college assistance. So....
Ray: Which is a very important thing. Tishel: Yes, college is very
expensive. So that was another reason. And
I'll be honest, I really liked the uniform so
that was another reason why I decided to join. Ray: That's very cool.
Andrew: I had a grandfather that was in World War 2, another
grandfather that was served shortly thereafter in the
101st Airborne Division. And uncle
who was like an older brother to me who served in the
reserves when the reserves still had infantry. And
I grew up with the stories and I grew up with that aspect
of it. And as well as the college portion of it
that was a big deal as well. But, that
kind of all played a part in me joining. Ray: So Andrew, you were a junior
too in high school or were you a senior? Andrew: I was a senior. Ray: And you were a junior? Tishel: I was yes.
Ray: When you joined. And are you finding a lot
of guard members that are joining when they're in high school?
Is that still pretty common thing? Andrew: I believe so.
Absolutely. Ray: And when Camp Ripley serves
the training in the summer time....
do you know how many units come from outside of the
state of MInnesota? Andrew: You know, I couldn't
answer a specific amount. But it is a regional
training facility now. So we do get soldiers
from all over the mid west that come here and train.
As well as emergency management individuals
and as well as MNDOT for plow training and what not.
Ray: Is there still a.....camp
in Sparta, Wisconsin that you know of? Is that still operational?
Andrew: You know, I'm unsure. [Ok] I know
that there's Fort McCoy somewhere down there. Ray: That's...yeah that's it. Andrew: And they are still operl
but they would be federal as a fort and
then we are like...you know like a state owned
entity with federal dollars that comes in as well. [Right, right]
Ray: So getting back to the Norwegian thing again
do you see this going on
long term? Is it something that's just been beneficial to both
organizations so that they can keep doing this do you think?
I mean, I know you don't make the decisions for that but. Tishel: I would hope
so cause I mean we have a lot of soldiers that I
know that have gone and they really enjoy the experience
and the different training and just
the different culture so I would hope that they
would continue to do this.
Ray: Let's just talk a few minutes if you don't mind about some of
the other things that people see if they've never been to
Camp Ripley. What...kinds of buildings
what kinds of things are going on there? Because I know when
I was there back in the 60's it's changed a lot.
I know you have at least a museum.
I think of all the animals from Minnesota...isn't that
there somewhere, an educational center?
Andrew: There is. Ray: And what is that....for? What
is that educational center? Andrew: So that educational center
is in the training and community center.
And it...what it's for is I believe a lot of the students go there
and what not. And it's set up in such a way where
they can identify the animals the different
animals that are native to Minnesota. And then later
on they can pull out their worksheets and then they can see whether
or not they got them right or not. It's a very
it's an amazing training tool. I've been there, I've seen it because
the amount of animals they have in there is...
it's amazing. Ray: And you have....what
other kinds of buildings or facilities do you have at camp?
You're probably there all the time you don't think
about it. But for somebody that just comes in and isn't familiar
at all with the camp what would they see? Andrew: I think what they'd take away
is how modern it's become. Even since I've started
there a lot of the old buildings when you think the
old army with the old tin buildings or
green tents or what not have been replaced with
education centers with all the latest technology.
We can communicate with other
facilities as though we're right there in the meeting
no one has to drive anywhere with you know the
technologies that are embedded in all the facilities now.
The new style of barracks that are being
built are so much better than what they used to be.
One would even say that each individual soldier has a small
little bit of privacy that wouldn't have been afforded to a soldier
of maybe in the 1960's, 70's
or 80's or heck even when I started in the 90's.
So there's a lot of that that you'll see. And you'll notice
that the big take away that I see from Camp
Ripley is not only how modern it is but
how clean it is. I mean everything is
upkept so nice. And everything is taken care of.
And you don't see broken windows and you don't see decrepit buildings.
And which is a testament to the
state employees that maintain the facility. Ray: And you also
have solar don't you have some solar gardens there? [We do]
And what do they do, what's the purpose of that? Are they actually
providing heat or hot
water or something? Or is that a demonstration site? I know
it got hit by a tornado I believe. Andrew: Right, so....
Ray: You had to start over with some of that. Andrew: We do have some buildings that are
geo thermal heated. [Oh really?] Which is kinda neat. And
then....some of them. And then we also have the solar
plant. And the solar plant actually feeds back
in to the electrical grid. So it doesn't necessarily
power Camp Ripley proper. It's contributing
to the grid itself. Ray: That's pretty cool.
So when people...you talked about snow.....plow
drivers, state employees coming to get trained,
do they do that in that educational building that you have
then? Is that kind of a multi purpose setting?
Andrew: That particular one that you're referencing is
purely for environmental students and what not. We have a
a much larger educational facility that
has state of the art class rooms in it, state of the art technology
designed for adult learning in the modern
way that we teach and instruct things. And that is
also attached to the dining facilities
so everything is co-located. And that's where the MNDOT
employees...they're in that area [Ok] so they'll eat there
they'll dine there, they'll use those particular facilities.
And then I think they're out in the maintenance base and what not, too, because
of the type of training that they're doing. Ray: So
on the culinary side are you responsible for ordering the food
for the camp? Is that part of your role? Tishel: That is actually contracted.
[Ok] They do have a
civilian side that does track all of the
other entities that would come into Camp Ripley. And then
we just track on the military side, just the military
units that are coming. [Cool] So we could have
anywhere from you know, 100 to 500 soldiers
and on the civilian side they could have anywhere from
10 to 120 people coming in
from whether it's the DNR, State Patrol,
different counties that are doing SWAT training
um, schools.
I know they have a lot of schools that come through. Ray: So it's really
expanded it's role hasn't it, that camp, from what it was
back in my era it was pretty much just military operations.
So now it's making use of state resources.
And training state employees in a variety
of levels. And you mentioned the conservation officers,
highway patrol, that's pretty cool. Tishel: Yeah they have...the driving
course out there. And I know my husband is a
deputy with Stearns county and they do a lot of their
drivers training and all kinds of active shooter
training down range at Camp Ripley and
then they also have a law enforcement facility that
they just built with a lot of....they have like the
behind the wheel driving stuff that not only we use
but I believe they use as well. Ray: So if a person were
interested to go to camp and just see what it's like do they have
to make an appointment for that? How do they get into the camp
to just to see what it is? Andrew: Well, what they
do is they come up and as long as they have a valid ID
and then especially like if they want to go see the
museum or whatever, security will ask them what their reason
is to be on post. But yes, the public is welcome.
And they just need to have a valid ID to get on post. Ray: Is there a cost to go see
the museum? Andrew: I believe it's a small fee
5 dollars give or take. Ray: Ok, have either of you
been in active duty? Tishel: I have not, no.
Andrew: I have been in active guard reserve but that's
very different than active duty. Ray: Not in the war zone. Andrew: Absolutely not.
Ray: Or anything like that. Andrew: Deployed to Bosnia and that was it.
Ray: So, my voice personally is
that every healthy kid coming out of high school
should be either in the peace corp or in the military. I thought
my military experience was a wonderful experience.
And I don't regret a minute of it.
Is recruitment going well for the National Guard? I know
you guys aren't recruiters, but is it still
are the....most of the organizations in the state
doing pretty well? Andrew: From what I've....been
told Minnesota is actually one of the better states
for recruiting. It seems like the youth in Minnesota are very
interested in joining the military and giving back and serving.
And that's...a testament to the state. Ray: It is.
And you know you look at the Red Bull ? units in some of the
over seas assignments they've had, they've had quite a few.
[Correct] Back in the 60's it was assumed the
National Guard only took care of things state side.
But our desert wars have changed that
significantly. Are you seeing many veterans
from the wars coming to camp? I suppose
you see some of those in the summer time? [Absolutely] Coming back with some of
these units? [Absolutely] Yeah. And um....
20 years is a pretty good time to serve. It's
there's a lot of benefits. Do you plan to go beyond the 20 years
as who knows? Andrew: I'm at 23 now, so. Ray: Oh you're at
23. So you're already going past that, good for you. [laughing]
Good for you. How about an airport? What's the airport condition like
at the camp? I mean, planes come and go there right? [Yes]
[They do] And I think you're flying C-17's?
Or not C-17's? Andrew: C-130's? Ray: C-130's cause
I see those from time to time. Those are
big humongous airplanes if no ones every been inside of one.
And they really can get up on a short runway.
They have so much power. [Absolutely] So what.....what's housed out there? What
do you have at camp? Andrew: So as far as the air field
goes I think it's...the air guards are located at
different locations. And they'll come and use
that runway to do training. So they'll fly their
train and then they'll fly out. We also have the
aviation for the Army. So you have your black hawks and then you have your
Chinooks that we have. And then we also have the unmanned
aerial recon vehicles, I'm not sure if that's the term
they still use. But they have their own little runway over there
too, I shouldn't say little, it's pretty big. I've been out on it. But
they're doing the unmanned training over there as well. Ray: So is that airport
in operation year round? Andrew: It is. Ray: It is.
And the people that work in that
are they private citizens? Or are they military?
Andrew: There's a combination of I believe they are contractors
and then they also have what we would call
green suiters or active duty or active guard or technicians.
Overseeing operations. Ray: So do you have many
military units that come to camp in the winter time to train
for winter operations?
Andrew: It slows, but there's always units training. Ray: There are.
Andrew: Even in the winter time. Ray: Really? Andrew: Correct.
Ray: And to your knowledge where are the farthest ones come from? What states
would be some of the long distance that they come from for
training? Andrew: Oh goodness, they come from all over. Tishel: All over.
Andrew: I guess ah... Ray: Really? Out west? Down south?
Alabama, Arkansas? Andrew: Absolutely. I mean heck even
the Canadians come. Ray: Really oh really? [Absolutely] So you have an
exchange program with them? Or is it just that they....? Andrew: They're coming to
train at Camp Ripley. Ray: But you don't go back to Canada and
do any training there? Andrew: I haven't been invited walleye fishing yet. [laughs]
I can hold out hope. Tishel: I'll take you. Ray: And when....the
Canadians come to Camp Ripley what are they looking for for experiences
there? Andrew: I think it's just a good facility. And it's
close to where they're at. So it's a good one to
good one to train in. Ray: I'm out of time. It went
fast. So pretty easy. You guys did a great job. Thank you for coming
and if anybody wanted to find out more about Camp Ripley
you have a website? Andrew: Ah, we do have a website.
Ray: And if you do we'll post it at the end of the show so you don't have
to memorize it if you didn't want to. [Thank you] But thank
you very much for jumping on board we appreciate it very much.
Interesting program you're doing with the Norwegians but I think
for people who have not been to Camp Ripley in the last 15 years
they really should just go there and see what a great place it is.
Thank you very much. [Thank you] You've been watching
Lakeland Currents where we're talking about what you're talking about.
I'm Ray Gildow, so long until next time.
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